Ebu8b Just so you know, i asked a translator of one of those novels and it's pretty much confirmed that it's for getting ready to transition into full on premium in the near future. So yeah you don't need to berate the guy, he does seem to have some foresight or 6th sense haha. He can feel that something is coming...
N0xiety It seems like you hate the Premium Program intensely. I can understand your concerns since no one hates free stuff. However, you should consider the side of the authors and translators. If all readers are unwilling to pay anything, how can they maintain their motivation to work in the long run? Asking for payment is not just for money, the ultimate goal is to build a positive model that connects readers and creators together, and make sure that all creators can be monetarily rewarded to continue with their lives, and even give them a chance to work full-time and have a stable future.
If all readers just request free content, then the market will never mature. In the end, the readers will suffer the greatest loss - there is nothing to read at all.
As a platform, we will try our best to give readers a chance to read for free, but we also need to ensure that creators can benefit in the long run.
WEBNOVEL_OFFICIAL I don't hate premium that much actually. I do understand your reasons for doing the changes you are doing. But i don't like the way you are doing it. Like how you reduced check-in ss expiration from 90 days to 30 days just to reduce peoples hoard of ss right before you transition into premium. It's a business move, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a sh*tty move to do to your long time readers...
N0xiety Hoard will lead to inflation. People could easily create many accounts and hoard a lot bonus SS. Then the market will be full of bonus SS transaction and less readers intent to support authors and translators by real SS. In long run, authors lost their motivations to do the global expenaions and probably I would lost my job since the global.project might be closed if no one pays at all lmao.
WEBNOVEL_OFFICIAL except you're not giving us a chance for free reading.
As a free user I get, on average, enough spirit stones to unlock one chapter a day.
As a free user I also get one (or more, although we haven't seen "more" yet) free chapters a day.
Under the current system, free chapters are NOT account specific, meaning that if I unlock one chapter ahead, then the next day the free chapter IS the chapter I just spent my daily spirit stones to unlock.
based on this, we can conclude that spending your "free" spirit stones every day actually does nothing to give you more chapter unlocks. Now, once could argue that you can save your spirit stones and then binge read, I will address that along with how this system is bad even for casual paying customers in the next paragraph.
So, let's say I save up a bunch of spirit stones (or buy them, same thing really), then I binge read 50 or so chapters. From that point on, if I don't want to spend more money I have to wait 50 days before the free unlocks catch up.
So really, how are you giving free users a chance, you're not even really giving paid users a chance.
WEBNOVEL_OFFICIAL Still with the excuses... I can still create many accounts even if you reduce the expiration to 30 days... If i were to create 10 accounts, would i even need to hoard? I can just use each account to unlock one novels daily premium chapters since every account can earn 20 ss per day. See? If you don't want people to abuse the system, then do something about duplicate accounts instead of reducing the expiration time of check-in ss... Since reducing the expiration of check-in ss to 30 days won't change anything. It's pointless... Oh right, it will change something, it will push people who don't want to bother with multiple accounts to create multiple accounts instead. Simple logic right?
WEBNOVEL_OFFICIAL You and EA are definetiley Chosen in the Hypocrisy sect for so tactfully omiting the huge profut marvin pf Quidian itself while singing praises about reader-author relationship
N0xiety
Nah he was already salty with the minimum monetization, nobforesight there.
WEBNOVEL_OFFICIAL Did you guys ever thought about a subscription model like spotify? Everytime someone mentions that it gets ignored, but instead I only see Qi staff defending Premium. I thought the idea about the beta was that the community can help to improve the system or give new ideas.
They won't use that kind of model because there is less money to win lol..
Threetimess less money to win
But more people will stay, the premium system won't sustain them for long. People will surely switch to pirate sites, if they don't get an easy solution.
Ebu8b I like your suggestion to have a subscription. I have one for netflix, and it's far better than paying for whatever nonsense tv content from my country, it's unlimited, and I'm familiar with the concept of a subscription. Though I've never seen an example of this done successfully for web novels.
On the other hand, this Premium-kind of pay-per-chapter system is often seen for Chinese web novels from Chinese publishers besides Qidian, like zongheng and 17k. It's not just a Chinese concept, there's also a western company called Tapas, who publishes original English web novels, and they're doing this too. The only difference between theirs and webnovel's premium, is that they don't provide free Gold Coins (their equivalent of SS). Korean's popular Naver web novels charge Naver coins to read locked chapters. There are probably other publishers from Korea and Japan that do this. To me, it looks like they're using a tried and tested system that has worked over different countries and cultures, that ethically pays translators, editors, and authors. This system isn't a strange and foreign concept to industry people in online literature over the world.
If I was a web novel author, I would like to get paid per chapter for something I created. After all, book authors get paid per unit too, so I think it's fair. As a freelance translator, I would like to get paid a fixed amount per chapter (just my preference) because it's not my creation and i don't like the idea of holding my rent money responsible for a crappy plot twist that I didn't write. However, I need to be paid a decent amount per chapter that will reflect my word count, my degree in Chinese and translation, and my professional experience in language/literature related work experiences... but also pay my bills because I'm doing this full time. I know its a difficult balance... What do you think?
N0xiety How would a company do that exactly? By making it very difficult for people to sign up? Or, trace IPs? Would either option save qidian from the problem of SS inflation without consequences?
I hope you can share another problem with the Premium or think of a better suggestion that qidian has the power to implement.
Paperplane So? I don't claim that i have all the answers. That's their job to find out. But one thing is for sure, f*king over their long time readers is a bad move.. Couldn't they just allow for their long time followers to use the ss they hoarded over months? Webnovel says that they are worried about inflation, but how can people with 1800 ss cause inflation? It will run out pretty quick if there are more premium novels. It's not that big of a number... But on the other hand if they don't solve the multiple account problem, hoarders will be the least of their problem. People can just create dozens of accounts and afford the premium chapters with daily missions alone! A single account would be enough to pay for the daily premium chapters of a single novel. So what was even the point targeting hoarders first before they even solve the multiple account problem? It is pointless and all it does is piss people off. That's what i'm sayin...
Paperplane How would a company do that exactly? By making it very difficult for people to sign up? Or, trace IPs?
Easiest solution sub system and no SS system anymore. New accounts wouldn't help anymore and people then can decide between free reading (1 chap per day) or subbing (2 or more per day) without any stupid mid way.
The premium way will just scare alot of people away (already did).
Paperplane Korean's popular Naver web novels charge Naver coins to read locked chapters.
Difference here is that between free readers and coin user the distance always stays at 3 chapters and doesn't increase e.g. ToG.
Paperplane western company called Tapas
And they sell email adresses to ad companies, seems like it doesn't work fine for them.
Paperplane I would like to get paid a fixed amount per chapter
And they still can get paid per chapter with a sub system.
N0xiety Did you even read what I wrote? I never claimed you had all the answers, but I did think about what you said and offered two solutions! Crying "FIX THIS!" is unreasonable here, considering the ethics of tracing IPs and the counter-productiveness of making it difficult to sign up. Honestly, the multiple account thing seems like a long-term problem many companies around the world have probably faced for many years, so (not to diss qidian but) I'm not sure how the company can suddenly find a solution for this. If people want to create smurf accounts for SS, they will. I bet they must feel helpless about this...
Mmm about the inflation thing, I can understand hoarding makes the premium redundant, so I'm guessing they want a clean slate for all readers to prevent people from being inactive like before? I say 'like before' because to have hoarded 1800 ss, how many days of inactivity must that have been? I assume their goal here to 1. create regular activity on the website 2. push for premium and equal pay for freelancers and creators. Yeah that'll piss people off for sure...
Ebu8b About the multiple accounts solution and pay per chapter reply...
A subscription would definitely stop the multiple email problem, but I'm not confident it will pay well enough, and I'm not confident qidian will be willing to test this out, since no other online literature service has done this yet (to my knowledge). Would an author get paid per subscriber's click? Or, would unpopular novels be carried? I ask because I don't know.
If you're comparing this to naver, are you saying that the gap is too big wide between free readers and SS here? I thought the gap was 10 chapters.
Oh I didn't know Tapas did that for their ad revenues. I have seen ads on there when I try to earn chapters for gold coins. Perhaps, Qidian should cut out ads all together, to avoid this. Nevertheless, they are an existing Western publisher that uses the same system.
Paperplane Inactivity? Firstly for hoarding alone you need to check in every day and vote every day. So that's 3 pages of visit atleast. Secondly, i have never been inactive and hoarded by watching their ads. I follow 22 novels so you can imagine more than a few having video ads... Now i'm getting rewarded for watching their ads like this. Don't you think i should be pissed off atleast a little?
N0xiety I did say... "Yeah that'll piss people off for sure..." and you have the right to be.
Err didn't think that part through, but you do realise I'm the dark on why they've done that too right? I thought I made it very clear that my assumptions are unfounded lol
Paperplane no other online literature
Wattpad, Kindle Unlimited, Scribp, Playster, 24Symbols, Overdrive (I think they went the total free way with only ads now, if I am not wrong), Amazon Lending Libary (similar to audible);
Sub systems and authors get paid per chapter/book (one time fixed + ads) or clicks + ads.
Paperplane Or, would unpopular novels be carried?
Well the unpopular novels already suffer. Unpopular ones earn 20$ per chapter while the popular ones get 50$+ (paid by Qidian). So they already don't earn same, that aspect wouldn't change and therefore no carry needed. I wish I could find the interview, where a german author (with a small fan base) explained how that system brought him more money than his blog with patreon.
Paperplane I thought the gap was 10 chapters.
Nope it's increasing. I opened a thread where is asked that question. RTW had distance of 12 back then, now it's 16.
Paperplane should cut out ads all together
Ehm there is a difference between having google ads and selling the email addresses to ad companies so that they can spam you full with emails. As long as Qidian stays with just google ads and doesn't sell the email adresses, there shouldn't be a problem.
Ebu8b All but Wattpad look like they're successful sub businesses for completed ebooks, not web novels or translated web novels. Maybe they should consider it after there's a decent amount of stories fully translated. That could be huge. Imagine downloading your fave books like kindle unlim... I had that sub and I enjoyed it. Now about Wattpad premium, it does look successful, but they released in October 2017, which is only a few months ago, and its the only one I now know of that has a subscription for online web novels. Again, if I was a business in this industry, I'd back the universal, long-running, tried and tested system.
Ok to every other point you've raised.
I told you that I liked the subscription idea. I care about fair pay for translators, editors, and authors, so if the subscription idea works with that, then they should beta test it. However, I'm also saying that, I can understand why qidian chose this option over the sub. Premium makes sense if you look at other businesses in web novels.
They don't care about their readers in their eyes we're cows milk =/
