Heaven_Dream It is clear, that is, the characters must have their own history, biography, descriptions of height, weight. figures, eye colors, worldviews, political preferences, hobbies. But the question is how to do this? If you just write - blah blah blah about it all, as in the initial reference chapter, will it be very boring? Not interested? What matters to me as a reader, for example, that Yuna-chan loves the Perfume group, there are pancakes with cottage cheese. and doesn't like to eat green onions? It would be much more interesting to me to know what she sells in the flea market and at what price? Where did she find coins for example, and how does local government relate to this? That is, ordinary household information. Well or something like that. Sorry, my English is not very good, the third language. But now I try to write easier to make it more clear.

Thank you for your advice, I'm sorry that I could not immediately answer them. I read yesterday, but after work I was very tired and could not write anything.

      Gourmet_DAO I wonder what to do if you already feel that the story is exhausted?

      Hmm. I don't face this. I write to chapter goals of an outline. So nothing is redundant in my stories. I'm meticulous with word usage even if to a reader it seems cliché or random. I write to a purpose on every chapter. If my story is cliche is because I purposed it that way. Story building is like fitting a jigsaw puzzle to me. At some point the end picture is going to be seen to reader before they reach the end. That is until they realize a jigsaw piece is missing at the very end 😅. I usually write for series, so my writing style is episodic even if I cater for paperback releases.

          Veronica8 This is similar to how I write, and I think that's the way it should be done. If you write with purpose, your story won't be exhausted until its end. I'll add that, rather than an outline, I use a guideline or a "waystone" technique. I do not keep notes and allow myself a lot of liberty to move within my story's critical beats. The main benefit of writing outside a predetermined diagram is that you can surprise yourself and your readers, and develop your story in a more organic way; a jigsaw puzzle, but one that feels natural, and not artificially constructed to fit a chart.

              The third question -

              The truth is all that stuff is terrible writing. The only web novel supports that stuff, and even then, it's only to talk about how sexy a woman is- the standard jade skin, huge tits. Etc we find in many novels. If you want to bring things up, make sure it affects the protagonist. For example, if he is a teenage boy, the whole jade skin thing might work. If you describe a setting, it should be to add a feeling, or emotion, or to cement a fact.

              For example, if the gun on the wall, alludes to the fact that the owner of the place sells firearms, or is part of a black market or whatever. It works. But, if you're adding raw data into your novel, your readers will be burdened with too much information.

              If your brought into the past, and you found yourself in your old home. The details of the home are the things that you would look at because it would act as evidence to an abnormal situation, but if you're going home on a normal day, you would rarely think of it.

              If it's snowing, and the protagonist is cold, that's important. If it's snowing 100 miles away, and the protagonist is not even aware, you should not be writing about it.

              In short, writers should only add details that affect the protagonist. If you wana write about blue eyes, write about what it does to the protag. If it does nothing, don't force it. You can bring that detail up in conversation etc.

              Like
              A girl venting, "OMG if only I had blonde hair and blue eyes."
              Protag. "There is nothing wrong with your eyes, I think there cute."
              "Shut up! Every girl has brown eyes. It's so normal."

              It's impossible to write about every detail and most details are not important. Image writing like billy walks into a store-Then describing all the objects in the store. The type of tile, all the other people within, etc. Then he goes in buys a soda and leaves.

              Your readers would be pissed. They had to keep track of all that data. Simply so that the protag buys a soda?

              Don't like this post. Thanks <3

                Acutelittletrap

                I'm not understanding. If Billy walks into a store, and we describe all the people that are there, the quality of the tiles, his purchase, etc... why would readers be pissed?

                We have a setting for the scene, the store. It's a bit old on the outside, paint flecks from the facade. Billy steps inside, the tiles are fatigued and yellow, and what few customers mill between the isles are the same. Old, haggard, like flecked paint; tired as they go about their evening. Their black hair and olive skin is familiar, because they look just like him, one of the misfortunates left behind by a booming economy.

                Billy retrieves a soda from an old cooler, but the light is out, and the fridge is broken. He takes the lukewarm drink to the register, and grabs a bag of chips on the way. There's a smiling mascot on the bag, and the chips are his favorite flavor. He sets the drink down on the counter and drops the bag beside it. A joyless employee rings him up; he checks his wallet, he only has a dollar. He sets the bag aside, makes his purchase, and leaves with the soda, feeling no better than before.

                If we're judging this paragraph by its end, we can say "oh, he only gets a soda, what was the point of that?" But we can use that scene to demonstrate the wealth of the area, the class that Billy lives in, and the demeanor of his peers. We can show that Billy is tired, perhaps old, and poor. We can show that he buys a warm soda, as opposed to a cold one, because as it was implied with the bag, it's his favorite treat. That he didn't complain that the machine was broken implies that he sympathizes, or understands, or perhaps isn't outspoken. Maybe he's the sort of person who doesn't make waves.

                "Show, don't tell," is one of the most iconic idioms in writing. Whenever possible, demonstrate by the features in your scene what your character is feeling, what their world is like, and where they are placed within it. All of that data is crucial part of setting the scene, when Billy gets mugged the next street over, as his ghetto crumbles to riots that catapult Billy into the story's next arc.

                    ZenoWriter

                    The problem with all of that is that while the writing may not look bad, you did not progress the plot if you kept that going. Also, you added other elements in that example, the status of the world. The protags viewpoint and feelings. A feeling of depression. So, there was nothing wrong with the example you wrote as is.

                    What I was talking about is more like-

                    I walked into the store. It contained apples, oranges, and new shelving and brand new televisions. They were a couple of teenagers on the side kissing. One of the teenagers is a boy and he goes to school. The girl is attracted to the boy. The light was on. I walked inside and grabbed an apple from the fridge. I took it to the register and paid.

                    Both examples have a good amount of detail, but mine does not do anything with it. What you wrote is far better. But, it's not because of the details it's because you made those details do something. That something is the difference, and that supports the plot. Because the setting gives mood which in turn affects the protagonist.

                    -Don't like this post.

                        Acutelittletrap You presented a situation where you expected detail would be unnecessary, because it was just 'getting a soda.' My example was how such a situation could add elements that expand on our one-bit character, and absolutely move the plot. I agree you can do description badly and not add anything helpful. Your guideline for describing what only effects the character is a good one.

                            Veronica8 You have your own writing style, since probably the series and books are slightly different in structure. But you are a great fellow! Experience and knowledge mean a lot to a writer or screenwriter! Wow! Thank you for sharing valuable information!

                              Veronica8 You have your own writing style, since probably the series and books are slightly different in structure. But you are a great fellow! Experience and knowledge mean a lot to a writer or screenwriter! Wow! Thank you for sharing valuable information!

                                  Acutelittletrap “It’s impossible to write about every detail, and most details are not important. An image written like Billy walks into a store, then describes all the items in the store. Type of tile, all the other people inside, etc. Then he buys soda and leaves. " - HAHAHAHAHAHAHA !!! Golden words !!!, I will remember this and I will follow this in the novel. Thanks!

                                      Wow, fiction is different than technical. In technical, you need to write how the system works, extra details are useless. We need facts. Therefore, it would be easier to write - Billy went to the store, bought soda, it was spoiled. I went around the corner to relieve myself. But he was robbed.

                                      But in fiction it is necessary to describe the store, then the region where he lives, the state of people, a lot - a lot of extra words that turn out to be superfluous, and they describe the world inside the novel, the world of a person, himself.

                                      Oh, damn, how complicated it is. Still need to be able to describe in such a way that it is interesting, useful and not boring and boring.

                                      But with the color of the eyes, I don’t understand at all why you need to know what the hero has - emerald eyes or black? If the color does not give any magical or superpower, then what is the use of it? His hair was black, his eyes were black, he was dark-skinned. So what? As a reader, this does not tell me anything. He was handsome, and to hell with him that he was handsome. If the main thing in the novel is the search for treasures, not a romantic relationship.

                                      As we were told two things - write to the fool, write easier. The first message led to the fact that the usual action, which could be described in 30 words, had to be described in 300 words. Fiction seems to be similar to this statement. Normal action: Bill bought soda - poisoned - went easier - turned around the corner - he was robbed. And in fiction you have to - give a description of things in the store, how the store looked, customers and the owner of the store - the type of soda - how Bill was poisoned - what was the corner of the house, who robbed him, how he was robbed.

                                      There is something to think about. Thanks.

                                        Why not describe in such key detail the key details, what does the reader care about the boy or girl that they like each other. Bill is the main character, for some reason he went for soda. Bill- shop- soda- robbery. This is a sequence of actions. And what is there in the background, if it has nothing to do with the hero, why is it? Should this boy and girl never appear in the novel again?

                                        Damn, writers have brain processes differently from techies. Isn't it easier to transfer information in batches?

                                        THAT is a simple combination - Billy - Shop - Soda - Robbery. With an additional description, replenished with details that can help describe the world in which Billy lives? And can it also change the whole structure - Billy - Shop - Girl - Boy - possible robber? - a possible hero? - a possible superhero? - can this boy and girl appear in the novel somewhere again? - soda - robbery - miraculous salvation?

                                        well ... there is something to think about

                                        Gourmet_DAO In my style of storytelling, the world reflects the characters, and the characters reflect the world.

                                        Take for instance Billy, and how we introduce him. We use no description of his character, just descriptions of his surroundings. He visits a run-down store, filled with fatigued people, and barely says a word as he pays for a sub-standard soda. We can say a lot of things about Billy that give context to a broader story, and because we create these ideas in the reader's head, we don't create confusion later, when Billy is mugged. Why was Billy mugged? He was clearly not in a great part of town.

                                        We can use physical traits, like being handsome, to play into or against certain expectations. Readers might first think a character has an easy life, because they're handsome. They might think they're sociable, or affluent. By setting up those expectations with a simple word like 'handsome' we can do our own twists. He was handsome, but airheaded. He was handsome, but unlikable. Details like those help create robust characters that either stick in the mind for their uniqueness, or add color to the world our protagonist travels: "Being handsome was considered a curse, it troubled him greatly," etc.

                                        And I'll mention that prejudices based on appearances, such as clothing, skin color, hair color, eye color, etc have existed for thousands of years. The way someone looks does have, and should have, an effect on any story where humans are being sociable. By addressing these things and including them in our stories, we create worlds that are relatable to things actual people go through every day. Some fantasies try to get as far from that as possible. I approach it and explore it.

                                        I agree with you, 'write to the fool, write easier' is a good saying. I also believe in 'write whatever you want, and your work will find its audience.'

                                            ZenoWriter An interesting look at the story. That is, beauty or ugliness is the hallmark. Can eye color and so on be a sign of superpower in different cultures? Curious!

                                            My heroes are ordinary, simple, not handsome, not freaks, an ordinary average person.

                                            Thank you, you're right, write what you want, just and you will find your audience! Respect for new and interesting thoughts for me!

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