JWPark so true, the popularity of the Novel is different and if the pay is not the same and biased or there are some unfavourable circumstances for the translator that could mess things up, right now if the readers want to read the advance chapter with add free they can go to Patreon which helps a lot to the Translator as well.
Keep it FREE for everyone, $6.95 Monthly Subscription to read ahead & ad-free
You can read Advance chapters and Add free in patrons, you want VIP because you just want to show your status here, simple thing make Qidian sell spirit stones and you can use that to skip add and read it, we don't need VIP, this type of privilege just divide the society, if you are so rich you can just hire somebody to translate for you or just donate them through patrons, this is like those cashers in the game who use their money to bully other people and happy about it, we are just commoners who love to read, rich people always have to ruin everything.
In case nobody has noticed, QI is gearing up to implement the paywall. Spirit stones look a lot like Qidian points in China where readers use to buy chapters and reward/tip the authors.
QI paywall will look something like this:
First 100 chapters will be free.
4 Spirit Stones for each chapter after that. The cost of each spirit stone is $0.01 USD. So basically $0.04 per chapter. $1 will get you 25 chapters.
Even if you earn some spirit stones daily, it will nowhere be enough so you have to pay.
- Edited
The rich ruin everything? It's the rich that subsidizing the poor in freemium business model.
For those that don't want to pay for music streaming, which is better?
Option A: $10 a month paywall (Apple Music) - no free music streaming
Option B: freemium service (Spotify) - free music streaming with ads. $10 a month for ad-free Spotify
What is better for the "commoners" / free users?
Option A: $0.04 per chapter Paywall that QI is about to implement
Option B: Free with ads and letting those that can afford it pay money to get advanced chapters, ad-free, lot of power stones
If you use Crunchyroll free version, do you want Crunchyroll to get rid of free ad-supported anime and start charging $0.49 per episode instead?
If QI implement a $0.04 per chapter paywall in January 2018,
what percentage of the readers will leave for pirate sites? (costing QI ad-revenue)
what percentage of the readers will pay?
- Edited
Here is my problem with this whole discussion:
Qidian seems determined to show user growth but neglects to setup a sustainable revenue model for that growth.
Case in point:
Qidian attempts to get everyone to use their mobile platforms like their Android app as the preferred method to read chapters. What is missing? A way to generate revenue. The android app is ad-free and doesn't cost anything to use. This isn't sustainable when you have all of the costs that are associated with a mobile app platform. Why not have ads in between chapters?
Another Case:
Qidian on their web platform uses infinite scrolling with a single ad between each chapter. That's great for a reader but a horrible idea if you want to actually make money through advertising. Getting rid of infinite scrolling would allow you to throw banner ads at the top & bottom of a page. This doubles your advertising revenue with minimal impact to the reader. It also increases your hit counts.
Here is an article on the impact of infinite scrolling:
https://digiday.com/media/publishers-see-finite-rewards-infinite-scroll/
The fact that Qidian isn't leveraging ad revenue as efficiently as they should tells us that advertising isn't how they expect to make money in the future. It suggests that they are going to find a way to force their existing model in China at some point on the international market.
To date Qidian has been pretty rigid in their thinking, ignoring, to their detriment, the dissatisfaction in the translation community.
Nothing wrong with infinite scrolling.
It's much better than having to click Next Chapter every time.
Having banners ads at the top & bottom of a page will just clutter the page and make the reading experience worst.
Ad-revenue is only generated when a user click on the ad. Would having banners ads at the top & bottom of a chapter drastically help improve the ad click rate compare to having the banner only at the bottom? Not worth the bad reading experience with having 2 banners ad
There are ads on the app. Maybe you don't see it because QI is testing some issues.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.qidian.Int.reader&hl=en
Webnovel
8,193
Webnovel (Cloudary Holdings Limited) Entertainment
Everyone Everyone
Contains ads
- Edited
ssound5rs Nothing wrong with infinite scrolling.
It's much better than having to click Next Chapter every time.
This is from the perspective of actually making a profitable website, not from the reader perspective.
ssound5rs Ad-revenue is only generated when a user click on the ad. Would having banners ads at the top & bottom of a chapter drastically help improve the ad click rate compare to having the banner only at the bottom? Not worth the bad reading experience with having 2 banners ad
This is incorrect, Ads also can generates revenue per 1000 views, Pay Per time frame and pay per click.
ssound5rs Contains ads
Just because it says it can doesn't mean that there are actual ads.
- Edited
ssound5rs one thing I would say is that and this may sound very odd, but a better range of ads are needed for the site as i go ones for women's clothing and stuff that id never clicked on yes I get the odd gaming on but once again for game types id never play, whoever picked the ad company, made a huge screw up as once again it show's they have no idea of the demographics of people that would use the site , and this, in turn, brings in less money
also the comment about epubs i made, yes selling via amazon I can see the point ( but only put very well know books on as a backdoor way of getting people to the site) but to me I think it's a bad idea as they take a cut and means less money to the site once again, the main volume of books should be sold via here as it's not like qi dosen't have tencent behind them
- Edited
Before QI implement the paywall strategy, how about trying out freemium service for 6 months as a trial/test?
$5.99 a month for premium services (ad-free, read ahead 5-10 chapters of every novels, 15 power stones daily to use as ranking votes)
Other novels site that charge monthly for premium:
https://j-novel.club/faq
J-Novel Club (for Japanese light novels/web novels): $4.95 a month for normal membership and $10.95 a month for Premium membership
https://royalroadl.com/premium
$2.99 a month for ad-free
https://premium.wattpad.com/
$5.99 a month for ad-free
Kindle Unlimited: $10 a month
Kindle Unlimited probably has about 5-7 million paying subscribers since they are paying about $500 million this year to authors/publishers for their ebook subscription service.
What do you, as the consumer, gain by a paywall? Nothing. Qidian-International has a HORRIBLE paywall on the mother site (Qidian) of like 1000 chapters unreadable without paying.
If you want to support the author and not the site or company you donate straight to the author, paying through anywhere else will make the author less than you gave. If ad-free is the only thing, you care about just download Ad-blocker free and straightforward.
If Qidian had deemed this profitable, they would have gone forward with this plan of a paywall already. The problem being they will lose more than they gain. If a paywall existed, I would leave that same day and go back to Wuxiaworld and Gravity Tales.
This plan (paywall/subscriptions), is likely already in the works and is also likely to be implemented soon (One to two years).
Much like every other subscription plan, it is a money grab at people who have too much of it. As I stated above if your first concern about this to support the authors donate to the author directly and not to the company and if ads are your problem use ad blocker.
- Edited
I don't think it will be worth. lets say i'm only reading 1 novel(because i'm too picky) and the monthly chapters release is below than 50 chapters and there's too little plot advancement. The patreon is much a better idea. the translator can have the money(i think QI still pays the translator) he/she got in his/her patreon while the QI will keep the money they got from the ad revenue. and i think you do not need to think about this paywall or membership thing because QI have their own plans.
"Kindle Unlimited: $10 a month
Kindle Unlimited probably has about 5-7 million paying subscribers since they are paying about $500 million this year to authors/publishers for their ebook subscription service."
shouldn't be used in your post, the reason being, it has extra like audiobooks etc, so is a bigger service from a known western company and has more to offer to start with
( btw i don't mean western/ eastern companies in a bad way, i just in the fact that they are more well known in the west over the east )
also, wattpad ad-free's only just started in oct 2017 , so once again I wouldn't add that in as they don't even know if it will work also the company's been running for 10 years +,
unlike qi in the west and no one knows about apart from the limited base of readers in most country's
anything over the 5.99 for an unknown company in the west would be seen as a joke also you picked Crunchyroll, they were a pirate website with followers before they signed deals, you've missed that huge point out ..ie they had been know about once again for a long time and had a following
i mean even youtube has just given up on it's paid for ad's free service
well, if you can't afford it?.. maybe it's time we stop to reading fiction..
jinxsan i can afford it unlike others who need the ad model as they are college/uni/school or just plain broke not thru their choice, but like hell do I want to pay for a load of book's
I will never want to read, especially some of the over the top nationalistic and racist stuff that's been released on the main qi site in china in the past or still now and has been tl'd in the past on other sites in the west like GT with SW like when the mc visits japan in that part of the arc
that's why I've said even within this post why not release epubs or arc's (when finished) or whole books then you can buy what you want to read like I love Once Upon A Time, There Was A Spirit Sword Mountain ( which is one of the better ln's on this whole site and has a great tl team, but ranks a lot lower then it should do but thats my oppion ) give me a hardback or released arc's as epub's I'll be more than happy to by them and i think they shoulkd be sold on here so, in fact, the website makes more, but also on amazon as that can be used for free backdoor adversiment of the site by selling the top tem ln's etc on the site
- Edited
Depending upon their goals in the long run, even 24$/per year or 2.33$/month subscriptions could be feasible for maintenance costs -- then adding additional optional tiers for those who wish to contribute more. The market for these English translated novels is still relatively small. It would not be smart to charge a large fee for premiums as of yet.
Ad impressions still average $1/1000, therefore there is still a large difference.
it so fascinating to read all these ideas,discussion and debates that i even forget to read latest novel chap..i like all these ideas and hope all can be implemented(i dont know anything pls dont cry at me) cuz i also have 2 3 novels i want to fully support as they are not popular in this site.hope u guys debate more cuz i want read these rather then some novels haha...
- Edited
PrehistoricDevil actually this thread is unnecessary because QI have plans. In the end they are just wasting their time on debating this subscription thing
Jlix19 who knows maybe they will consider it ...
Maybe they are undecided between paywall and freemium? I don't think it has been set in stone about what QI will do.
QI will have 2 choices in the near future since ad-revenue isn't enough:
1) Paywall (in China, it's $0.02 per chapter so it might be $0.04 here)
2) Freemium service where everyone can read for free and charge extra monthly for those who want a premium experience. About 5-10% of the users will subscribe.
Qidian can choose to experiment with Qidian International since QI will always be tiny compare to Qidian.
QI doesn't have to follow Qidian's paywall model. It can choose freemium service instead....which is very popular in the West (Hulu, Spotify, Pandora Radio, Wattpad, Crunchyroll, Dramafever, Viki, New York Times, Washington Post all offer free services and charge a monthly subscription for those who want Premium service.)
Look at the New York Times digital ad revenue and digital-only subscriptions:
NY Times website is a freemium service since users can read news article for free. Pay monthly to read more news article and ad-free experience.
DIGITAL AD REVENUE: $49 million for the quarter x 4 quarters a year = $196 million a year
DIGITAL-ONLY SUBSCRIPTIONS: $86 million for the quarter x 4 quarters a year = $344 million a year
Obviously, Qidian International won't have anywhere near the New York Times total users. Even 2% of NY Times digital would mean $4 million a year in ad-revenue and $6.9 million in digital subscription revenue.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/01/business/media/new-york-times-earnings.html
The company said on Wednesday that digital advertising revenue in the quarter rose 11 percent, to $49 million. The company also added 105,000 net digital-only subscriptions for its news product, helping to push digital subscription revenue to $86 million, a 46 percent increase compared with the same period a year ago. Over all, the company said, total revenue increased 6 percent in the quarter, to $386 million.
Including subscriptions for its crossword and cooking products, The Times now has nearly 2.5 million digital-only subscriptions.
Reference: TOS:4 (Payment) https://m.webnovel.com/help/terms_of_service
They have plans alright.
Cridole that's a standard ToS for most sites just to cover their arse's even if they weren't soing to sale stuff ( but they will at some point) I even have it on my company site and we don't sell online apart from the odd thing on eBay , it's like in the UK , you have to have full disclaimers on company emails and it's a whole lot of bs but you have to do it by law
Pizz Mhm, I get it. But still... the wording is more suggestive than other sites declaring "rights to charge fees" as opposed to "may charge".
Hmm... well, I may be wrong, since they have declared their intentions:
https://acts.webnovel.com/2017/59195029/index.html
well we've always known they will change for something, but at this point is can be anything, like epub's vip , stones etc etc etc, as I said I think you reading to match into it but I understand where your coming from
Crunchyroll: $83.4 million subscription revenue
Crunchyroll ad-revenue (let's assume 50% of subscription revenue): $41.7 million a year
= $125.1 million a year in revenue
Qidian International 5% of Crunchyroll = $6.255 million a year
Qidian International 7.5% of Crunchyroll = $9.38 million a year
Qidian International 10% of Crunchyroll = $12.5 million a year
Rome wasn't built in a day...so it will take time for QI to grow in popularity, attract more users, gain more monthly paid subscribers. Even 10% of Crunchyroll size 3-4 years from now would generate $12.5 million a year in revenue.
Rooster Teeth niche video streaming: 250,000 paying subscribers
https://digiday.com/media/how-crunchyroll-is-helping-build-a-bundle-for-niche-streaming-channels/
Crunchyroll’s video business includes more than a million subscribers paying at least $6.95 per month to access a large library of anime titles as well as merchandise, events and more. The channel also has an ad-supported, free tier, which it has used as a marketing vehicle to get those interested in anime to eventually pay for access to more content and perks.
It’s a model implemented by other niche streaming channels reaching passionate fan bases. For instance, Rooster Teeth, the Austin, Texas-based digital studio owned by Fullscreen, in which Otter Media owns a majority stake, has built a membership program that has roughly 250,000 subscribers paying at least $4.99 per month, according to a source. Rooster Teeth also uses its site and YouTube as ad-supported free tiers.
It looks like niche streaming service Rooster Teeth also use the freemium model and now have 250,000 paying subscribers who pay at least $4.99 a month.
Rooster Teeth is on par with QI in term of Android app downloads.
Installs
100,000 - 500,000
----------------even if QI is only 1/3 the size of Rooster Teeth's 250,000 paying subscribers, that is still a lot of paying subscribers.
Enlightened_Being so true
I really just want to get rid of the ads on mobile. Let me pay the premium for that.
- Edited
ssound5rs
1ST: I don't disagree, your posted numbers, but you seem to have a huge problem,
that you still don't seem to get, each time you post a "number" every one of those sites has been around for a good few years before they started charging ( so between - 2-5yr and 10yr in wattpad's case ),
somewhere even pirate site's for they did deal's with companies, others have huge extra benefits like video's / audiobooks and other deals, so they had a userbase before they decided to try sub's and to be honestly this is still trying to get a userbase and will be for a good few months yet
your missing all of that out all of that as you seem to try and push the idea's of subs for a site, to be honest still needs a lot of work done, have huge problems with QUILTY OF RELEASE'S plus the amount of books still , it has artwork that belongs to other works ( please check NU forums for the huge post about that) this whole push is feeling more and more that you, in fact, work for QI , as I have said before I don't have aproblem 1. with the ad-wall but good it needs better add'd as i got a load that would are totally useless to me i think i get 1/10 a good i'd, in fact, click on and at a later dated some type of ad free vip etc
2nd: the Google numbers you keep bring up is just a rank and I bet if you could see the real number it would be low100k-150k and I don't mean that in a bad way but I'd say that more likely due to the time the apps been back in to the store and yes it will go up I'm not saying it will not in anyway
3rd: the biggest problem is that at the second the userbase some are still not happy with the way QI push it'sself in to the market, once again I hearsay yes they should get paid but there is still a lot of hate towards some of their actions, due to whatever bad advice they got the 1st time around and that still needs a bit of time togo and also once again as I've said, "QI/Webnovels" aren't known at all in the west, no matter if they've just had an ipo in china etc and that will still take time, the more this is pushed the more it will put people off,
i say that as I run my own public limited company and i have to deal with stuff like this for other comapnys i look after
- Edited
Did you know how much is QI revenue from their paywall system?
It's much much much more than that of freemium
Evidence that Qidian International paywall will generate much much more revenue than Qidian International freemium?
it's fine if you could get free spirit stones everyday
If you read 2 chapters a day, then 8 free spirit stones is enough. If you read more, it will cost you $0.04 per chapter.
- Edited
You don't need to be around for many years before you start charging for premium service because new users will get the same content as paid users.
Spotify is a good example of freemium and they charge from day 1 for those that want to skip ads.
As of July 2017, Spotify had 60 million paying subscribers worldwide, up from 30 million paying subscribers in March 2016.
Free music streaming with ads (attract a lot of users)
$9.99 a month for Spotify Premium to skip ads ( some of the free users will switch to paid users).
I don't get the logic that www.webnovel.com has to be around for many years before offering a premium service for those who want to skip ads.
New free users and current free users will get the same content as paid users who want to skip ads.