CacackleLasson Not being passive aggressive. Just that...by that definition, anyone who jumps into a river to save a drowning stranger is a beta. Or anyone who saves a kid from being knocked down by a car.

Also, it's kind of strange that you appear to be puzzled that a character capable of courageously risking his life to heroically save someone without asking for anything in return can be so popular. Of course people want to see the hero save the damsels in distress.

Oh, if you're talking about a guy who is a "punching bag for girls", then you're probably mixing him up with a simp. The correct definition of a beta male is a guy who tends to assume a passive or subservient role in social or professional situations. It may or may not have anything to do with how he interacts with girls.

      Tomoyuki
      I thought the person meant saving every single girl the MC meets, even when sometimes the girl doesn’t need it. Now I’m confused 😅

      Also what is simp? I see that a lot too. I sound like some old person, but I swear I’m in my early 20s, I just typically stay of social media most of the time and don’t talk to people. So I’m confused all some of these terms.

          RJMidnight I mean, if you see a person in danger, regardless of whether of the gender of the person, you will save him or her, right? And you wouldn't know if she needs saving, anyway. Hindsight is 20/20 - how would you know the girl can swim, or will be able to jump out of the way of the car in time? And how does that make you a beta male? Beta males usually means passive, indecisive and submissive guys who avoid confrontation or risks, so any guy who is decisive enough to risk his life and actively jump into a situation to save someone, even if she's a girl, already contradicts the definition of a beta male.

          Usually beta males are like bully victims, unable to stand up to the alpha males who bully them (hence the stereotype of them being submissive and avoiding confrontation). They allow themselves to be pushed around without fighting back (it doesn't matter if the other party is a guy or girl - but most often they get pushed around by so-called alpha males).

          Simps are guys who are overly desperate for women, especially if she is a bad person, or has expressed her disinterest in him whom which he continues to obsess over, to the point they are willing to be her punching bag or slave (lets the girl make all the decisions for him, allows her to manipulate him). A guy so desperate for a girl that he willingly allows her to take advantage of him (does whatever she requests of him without asking for anything in return...except that he is obviously doing it in the unlikely hopes that she will eventually sympathize with and fall for him in return). Basically what Casual_Laison claimed is a beta male, but he mixed them up.

              Beta MC? It makes me think of a game tester who has to hunt down all the game dev easter eggs and crack the game to write an IGN walkthrough.

                Tomoyuki
                I meant sometimes in the manga the girl doesn’t need help, but the MC would go in and make the situation worse.

                I barely go out and when I went to school, I went to school in an extremely bad area so helping someone would end up in death.

                But if someone is in trouble, serious trouble, it is good to help.
                Still I barely go outside. So, I can’t say anything about helping from my own experience.

                Thanks for explaining what a beta MC and Simp is.

                    RJMidnight Yeah, but the protagonist is not supposed to know that. We, as the audience, knows the girl doesn't need help. We know the poor guy will make things worse. But the protagonist doesn't. If I'm in his position, I wouldn't know either. I'll just act according to the situation, I wouldn't know if the girl has some sort of superpowers (who even assumes that in reality, anyway?) or already has some trick up her sleeve. Besides. it's a convenient boy meets girl scenario.

                    It's all right if you think you do not have the ability to help and stay out of things. I do that too, sometimes. That's why I find the people who do not hesitate to help courageous and admirable. I am not going to condemn people for being cowards just because they don't help others, but I just find it ridiculous that there will always be a group of people who condemn others for selflessly helping others. It makes no sense to me. If you don't want to help, that's fine, but why insult and condemn those who do offer their help? Why label them a beta or loser or sucker, for example? Are they insecure or something? Perhaps they feel guilty that they didn't help, and so to justify their lack of action, they decide to demonize the people who took action? I don't know.

                    Nah, it's just that a lot of readers throw around these terms without understanding what they really are. I've seen readers complain about the main character being a simp all because he was nice to a girl or helped her when she was in trouble. As if it's something to deride. Or they call a protagonist a beta male because he refuses to sleep with the heroines throwing themselves at him. As if being responsible is the same as passive and indecisive. They are among the most misused terms, especially on the Internet.

                        Tomoyuki
                        True true. (I tend to drop them when romance start to hit cause I don’t do romance).

                        In real life, my main problem is with people who record a bad situation and don’t help.
                        I’m not a selfless person, but if someone really needs help, I will try to help them. But at the same time I stay home because I’m tired of the world.

                        And oh okay. See that is the reason I’m off the internet most of the time, unless I’m reading. I just got back on because I wanted to post up my story, which led me to being active on webnovel, discord, and the forums. But sometimes it makes me want to shut off the internet cause a few people can be toxic.

                        I don’t like toxic nor arguments (had enough of that). That is why I barely have friends and keep to myself.

                            RJMidnight I don't blame you. I wish I have more courage and could be a hero, but quite frankly, I am not. So I am in no position to condemn other people for being cowards because that would be hypocritical. I don't expect people to be selfless and noble. But I think the world shouldn't be something to be tired of. You just haven't met the right friends, I think.

                            Also, one good friend is worth a hundred acquaintances, so it's quality over quantity.

                                Tomoyuki
                                Same. Sometimes society makes it hard to weave out the positive.

                                And that is true. That is why my cousin and certain family members are enough for me. I had true best friends, but they went off to college and living their life so we barely talk.

                                    In my opinion, probably no. The content of a novel (in my perspective) must have a balance with its environment, story, plot armor, characters, side characters, genre, fillers, the emotion that the author wants to convey, the overall setting and atmosphere. Not one must be greater than the other, so watching a novel that has the criteria of a beta MC is just worthless and pitiful for me even if that is a growth type novel.

                                      Wouldn't Harry Potter qualify as a beta MC? He gets abused at the beginning and just takes it.

                                      I think it really depends on personal taste.

                                        kazesenken ive read works where it spans for hundreds of chaps and the mc is still beta. Which means it wasnt about development

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