Carciphones_02 oh my watch some soap opera it has everything you are asking for
I want to Diss the Romance Novel with Cliche plot!!!!!
Carciphones_02 oh my watch some soap opera it has everything you are asking for
Winzentwinni so true totally agree fl is labeled strong person but when ml enters she miraculously looses all her strong points don't know why and becom super submissive
Carciphones_02 I do remember one harem manga like this , I mean I really don't like harem theam in novel but that manga was really good I think the name was'battle through heaven'
Carciphones_02 I think even a good romance novel doesn't need a sexual encounter to say the least to be considered a romance novel.
Which is why I wouldn't put any in my story, there might be instances of kissing, cuddling, and sexual tension but never would they involve themselves in it. I rather base my story on their actions and thoughts, motives and plot. I view it as some just write the sexual stuff to gain readers.
Which is why I'm writing a teen fiction(Uncertain Friendships) which clearly depicts school life, falling out of the usual crush next door kinda trope 
she clearly doesn't like him because she doesn't want to go by the crushing on him because he's nextdoor but seems out someone else and it's mostly based on friendship not entirely the lovedovey scenery, also my fantasy (Princess Not in Distress) a role reversal where the Princess isn't someone who needs to be saved and throws a good punch when she's kissed when she clearly doesn't want to partake in the act.
5 days later
Once again an urge to boost this up cos I don't like scrolling down to find it again
What on earth
What kind of novels are we reading where rape happens and that's acceptable?
I write a novel where my main characters are evil beyond measure, to the point of genociding the entire human world, but damn. Have some limits.
Dubstheduke Are you seriously suggesting that rape is worse than genocide?
I had so much fun reading this thread ! Honestly.
The Mary Sue is always so annoying because she's been soooooooo unhappy in her childhood, but somehow grew up unscathed. Psychologically wise, I don't see how you can possibly grow up with psychotic parents and be sane but hey, let's ignore that (Disney did it in Raiponce so :p)
Yes, I'v found as well that many, many novels have a rich/powerful man which doesn't leave much space to female characters.
I might be a bit of an alien. I love to write love stories where people are sane, more or less on the same foot, and can respect the other. Sex is consensual, and rape definitely not an item.
Perhaps it is a cultural issue. But honestly, in France, our love stories are most of the time really ugly. Abusive behaviour and manipulation are really standard in our art. I hate it.
I feel soooooo old sometimes. But again, I got COVID for my birthday so ... :p
Anyway. I'm going to preach for my own church. If any of you want to check my ongoing story and give some feedback, I'll take it gladly. I'm not getting many readers.
https://www.webnovel.com/book/stage-fright_19074257706310705
Ps: NewCultivator I've read the article as well, pretty good material !
Winzentwinni Peace joy and pancakes ! I'll remember that one, it's such a great expression !
A little pampering is good but damn, when do those women have time to even sleep !!! :D
SrtaA I've just read one of those... somehow, it felt so unrealistic.
But aside from that, I found that if very nicely written, you can write almost anything. The most uninteresting plot can become amusing and entertaining, while the best of plots can be boring to death.
The only thing I have real issues with is inconsistency. When things happens because 'it's the plot' but it still doesn't make sense.
It's not only romance. I've found this type of things anywhere. Anyway, I'm ranting :p
Perhaps
I never said that anything my characters do is acceptable, but I personally think that given the context of the story genocide is more acceptable than rape.
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Dubstheduke I don't know if there exists any context where genocide is more acceptable than rape (neither is acceptable and it's silly to weigh one against the other in the first place). The fact that you condemn rape, and then unironically talk about how genocide is within limits whereas rape isn't already makes your statement disturbing. "Rape is evil! How can anyone possibly write about it? At least I know my limits. I only have my characters commit GENOCIDE!"
By your logic, there will be contexts where rape is "acceptable", apparently because trashy cultivation stories such as Against the Gods and others often use rape as a method to save the lady (often against her will). That's utter BS.
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Tomoyuki I'll begin by noting that my comment was sarcastic, and meant to be hypocritical. So thats one. In no situation is genocide ever acceptable.
However, think about it. In terms of writing a story, what does it say about a person when a character rapes someone?
Most importantly, why is that character still being portrayed in a positive light? In the case of these chinese novels, the heroine still loves the man despite the fact that he has done something so disturbing.
On the other hand, what does it say about a person who is driven to madness to the point of genocide?
It shows that this person has been filled with suffering around them so much to the point where they just want to destroy everything.
The two, to me, are like night and day.
Dubstheduke Oh, sorry.
Dubstheduke Yeah, sarcasm is alwaus difficult to write in a forum :D
But anyway.
There used to be a book called Lolita written by a Russian author, naturalised american. It told the story from the point of view of a fourty something man who had a relationship with a 12 years old girl. It is obviously wrong, everything in this is wrong, because the girl is trapped my manipulation.
But it was written so well that you could emphatise with the main character, and understand his reasons.
It doesn't make it right to understand. It is actually a sign of great mastership to write a character that does 'evil' things in a manner that it feels justified.
We can understand, without accepting it, right ?
It still doesn't quite justify why the women that are raped still like their agressor. Perhaps a psychological fail safe that prevents them from realising they are abused ?
I heard of many women understanding, years later, that the pressures they had endured were not 'normal'. It's not easy to take the distance.
d_elfe See, I can understand something like that. It really depends on how it's written. But with these ones in particular, there is no real reason for the girl to still like the guy. They just do because he's "Badass" or "Smooth" or whatever.
Dubstheduke Can't agree more. It feels like people have lost sense, sometimes, of what a non toxic relationship is.
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I literally just came across a manhua series titled The Runaway Wife or CEO Quan, your wife is getting away, and it's identical to what SrtaA said regarding pregnancy. The male lead is awful as hell - he demands, for unrealistic reasons, that the female lead bears his heir, and after giving him a son, they will divorce after three years (if she's a daughter, she takes the daughter). The drama is over the top, the female lead is a pity beggar Mary Sue - everything bad that can happen to her just happens to her. It's horrible. Her father got framed and imprisoned for embezzlement, her mother died from a heart attack after learning that the father got framed - and somehow she's the only one attending her mother's funeral while her relatives plot to steal her father's company and hoard the riches to themselves. Oh, not to mention the usual cliche where her cousin steals her fiance, and the fiance cheats on her and is engaged to the cousin instead, AND THEY SHOW OFF THEIR FLIRTING RIGHT AFTER THE FEMALE LEAD RETURNS FROM HER MOTHER'S FUNERAL - a funeral that all the relatives and fiance were absent, for some ridiculous reason. The CEO male lead shows up, basically forces her into marrying him to bear him a heir, and because she's driven to despair, she has no choice but to agree (unrealistic as f), on the condition that he helps prove her father's innocence and get him out of jail. However, the CEO male lead - on top of scheming to buy and acquire her father's company - constantly treats her coldly and reminds her of the three year agreement, brings her home and does nothing when his mother insults the daughter-in-law while trying to match him with his childhood friend (who is giving her grief). The final straw came when the cousin and her mother and grandmother scheme to seduce the male lead away from the female lead, so the cousin visits the male lead CEO at his company and slanders the female lead, claiming that she was the one who stole her fiance and she caught them in bed (when it was the other way around). Despite already taking the female lead's virginity (which is f-ing unrealistic, given that she was engaged to another man for THREE YEARS), the male lead pretends to listen to the cousin RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE FEMALE LEAD and coldly demands an explanation from her. Even though he knows the truth. I know he's pretending and he knows the truth, but what the f is he trying to do? Make her jealous? Play childish games to deliberately hurt the female lead, who has nothing but bad things happen to her? It's so over the top, cliche, overly dramatic and trashy that I wanted to throw my computer at the wall after reading it.
You know what's the worst thing? The female lead will probably fall for the male lead anyway, and he'll - in cliche fashion - refuse to divorce her after three years. Maybe there will be amnesia thrown in for the laughs. Ugh.
Good lord, I give up. Can't we have more stories like Trial Husband: Need to work hard instead? Or The Icy Chairman's Cute Little Wife (funnily enough, Li Jing Zhen isn't icy at all, he's really passionate and nice)? Romance stories where the couple actually respect each other and don't play nonsensical games? Less over the top, exaggerated cliche drama and more hard work, overcome trials together, feels good type of stories? Why are there so many stories advocating such toxic relationships?